An effect that controls VRC7's Modulator Level would be very useful. Would allow for some cool LFO sounds without making a bunch of instruments. Maybe even a second one that changes it similar to the way vibrato changes pitch.
Also, I figure this would be easy to implement: an option to export all channels separately to .wav in one go would be convienient for those of us who like to level/pan/EQ in other programs.
I believe both of these issues are due to limitations of the original hardware.
I'd say it doesn't matter imo. Like explained above, rediculous clock speed changes aren't supported and like in that video I showed, that isn't possible either. The way I see it, if you want to stick to the limitations, you should be able to, but, if you want to be creative and use every expansion chip and do some really amazing things, you should be allowed that as well.
Nah, there's a difference. The NES does support clock speeds other than 60 Hz (50 Hz for PAL). You need to modify your unit yourself, but it can be done. The YM2413 (which is the VRC7's sound mapper) can only load one custom instrument into its memory buffer at a time; there is no way to expand that (or else you wouldn't call it the VRC7 anymore).
As for the tempo, I don't see what the fuss is there. It does skip a few frames when you use non-integral tempo values, but it never interefered with creativity in my case, and if it does, well there's tonnes of tricks you can pull that let you achieve several tempi. Making it stable at any tempo would be cheating the hardware really.
And like tadpole said, the idea behind FamiTracker is to make music that is theoretically playable on a real NES, so I'm absolutely certain such a request would be denied by jsr anyway.
fluidvolt wrote:
An effect that controls VRC7's Modulator Level would be very useful.
I believe both of these issues are due to limitations of the original hardware.
I'd say it doesn't matter imo. Like explained above, rediculous clock speed changes aren't supported and like in that video I showed, that isn't possible either. The way I see it, if you want to stick to the limitations, you should be able to, but, if you want to be creative and use every expansion chip and do some really amazing things, you should be allowed that as well.
I feel like this rule should be stuck to: if the NSF format supports it, FT should support it. Things like "having stereo" would not hamper a NSF release as it would just ignore the stereo commands, and the file could still play. Multiple expansions is fine too, and ridiculous clock speeds is actually doable, so I dunno why that's an issue.
Things like "enabling multiple custom instruments at the same time" should not be allowed though, because you'd end up with an unexportable file (the NSF spec does not, and probably will never support this). That's the point of limitations, sure having more channels relaxes these a bit, but each expansion has its own unique sound. If you want all custom instruments, use a Genesis :P
I get what you mean. But if you have to modify a system for different clock speed isn't that cheating the hardware in a sence? So wouldn't that mean with alterations achieving a desirable custom tempo would be possible as well? I've tried the Underground theme from SMB3 and I can't match it to the original tempo for the life of me without a slight tempo adjustment, but if I do that, of course, it'll sound off. I don't even mind the clock speeds and I actually like the idea of stereo panning. So if things like that were implimented, it doesn't mean you HAVE to use them.
But if you have to modify a system for different clock speed isn't that cheating the hardware in a sence?
Yes, but it can be done on a real NES, and the NSF format does support it (not all players do however; so far I've only found one that works). Besides, if you want to use a tempo that falls outside the range of integral tempi, you can always change the clock speed. :p
You simply cannot, however, modify the YM2413 to support multiple custom instruments playing at the same time. It can't be done at all, ever.
EDIT:
Raijin wrote:
I've tried the Underground theme from SMB3 and I can't match it to the original tempo for the life of me without a slight tempo adjustment
No, I've realized that the VRC7 can't do that now. I understand that bit so I'm not going to mention that again. And about what you say to achieve integral tempo, I don't even know how to change the clock speed in FT, nor did I even know you could.
Rushjet1: If there were a Genesis tracker as amazing as Famitracker, I'd be using it. The YM2612 is my favorite after all (doesn't mean I dislike other chips ofc as I wouldn't be using FT in that case)
Those aside, What about using all the chips at once? It's possible to export to NSF and play it back after all.
Edit: oh wow, that does sound pretty accurate, but did real NES games actually use the Fxx command in such a way? Here, I'll show you what I got out of the underground theme. I mainly did this to practice triplets so no "nicetas rage" please.
Rushjet1: If there were a Genesis tracker as amazing as Famitracker, I'd be using it. The YM2612 is my favorite after all (doesn't mean I dislike other chips ofc as I wouldn't be using FT in that case)
Have you tried TFMaker? It's a tracker for the YM2612, but you don't get to use the SN79489 which the Genesis can.
Raijin wrote:
Those aside, What about using all the chips at once? It's possible to export to NSF and play it back after all.
If you're really set on FM synthesis, Adlib Tracker II for DOS is a very powerful tracker for Adlib/Sound Blaster cards. Up to 12 (?) channels, and support for 4 operators.
I have it on my old Gateway solo laptop, and I mess around with it at school all the time. If you don't have a system with DOS installed, there's always DOSBox.
I have tried TFMaker. It's pretty cool, but BECAUSE it can't do the PSG channels, I don't like it much (even though I could do PSG with Famitracker's standard 2a03 square waves. It isn't very "user friendly" to my tastes compared to FT either.
vgthing: No thanks, I steer clear from DOS things. That all just confuses me, plus I haven't the card for it.
I have tried TFMaker. It's pretty cool, but BECAUSE it can't do the PSG channels, I don't like it much (even though I could do PSG with Famitracker's standard 2a03 square waves. It isn't very "user friendly" to my tastes compared to FT either.
I see what you mean. I've done a few covers in TFMaker but I find it quite complicated too. If you want to use it and do PSG though, use MOD2PSG2, not FamiTracker. MOD2PSG2 is a tracker for the SN79489, so you'd get more accurate results with that than with FamiTracker.
Of course, this is very theoretical because you mentioned you wouldn't use TFMaker...
There's also XPMCK which supports YM2612 + SN79489... But you'd have to learn MML. :p
Hahaha! Yeah, I think I'm not cut out for MML. Scripting music, is basically what it is, right? Major Kudos to you guys that use it.
Anyways, Thanks for clearing up the whole VRC7 and Tempo thing. I don't have that much knowledge about that, so you guys explaining it to me without getting frustrated about how I don't shut up and understand things right away like some people do makes me quite happy.
Also, I figure this would be easy to implement: an option to export all channels separately to .wav in one go would be convienient for those of us who like to level/pan/EQ in other programs.
Export to NSF and run through towave (see signature)? :D
In all seriousness, that was crazy easy to implement for towave, so I don't imagine a problem.
Also, I figure this would be easy to implement: an option to export all channels separately to .wav in one go would be convienient for those of us who like to level/pan/EQ in other programs.
Export to NSF and run through towave (see signature)? :D
In all seriousness, that was crazy easy to implement for towave, so I don't imagine a problem.
It would be cool to have the feature in Famitracker, but good enough for me!
Though I don't see MMC5 as being supported. Misprint or is that the case?
Either way, thanks for the tip!
Edit: Just did a test with a MMC5 track and it works great. Thanks man!
Though I don't see MMC5 as being supported. Misprint or is that the case?
Either way, thanks for the tip!
Edit: Just did a test with a MMC5 track and it works great. Thanks man!
Yeah, I was not completely aware of the capabilities of the programming library I used when I wrote the readme. I just uploaded an updated file with more accurate descriptions and a real license. Don't bother re-downloading, though - the EXE's the same, and the only thing I added to the readme was "MMC5" in the list of expansions.
Including these NES limitation-breaking things pleases 100%. Not including them pleases 50%. Just because the effects/etc. are there doesn't mean you have to use them!! Also the illegal effects such as panning (Txx) could be erased in the .nsf on exportion(?), so the <unavailiable_strikethrough>smelly</unavailiable_strikethrough> people who actually want to play it on actual hardware can.
_______________________
iGotno_scope wrote:
im going to continue making this crazy stuff then after a while my style will be so sick that you will be like damn suuun that shit is so sick i dont even get it. i will be like bro its ok.. you dont have to.
