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Theory discussion Posted: 2011-05-31 21:18  (Last Edited: 2011-06-03 05:52) Reply | Quote
Xyz_39808

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#17810


Posted: 2011-05-31 21:26  (Last Edited: 2011-05-31 21:28) Reply | Quote
Tommittaja

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#17811
hmm..
pretty good for a beginner's guide - for tracking.

about general theory don't you think you should go first with scales (like major, minor, pentatonic, blues, harmonic, melodic), then with tonal degrees and how they form the scales?
theory behind how augmented, diminished, sus2 and sus4 are formed too?

or something...
(haha you could jump right to modes after that but basic theory might not be the best place for those...)

E: it's weird, i've forgotten how the circle of fifths works :D
maybe since i play guitar i just move up a fret or so...
damn me quitting piano ;D

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Posted: 2011-05-31 21:34  (Last Edited: 2012-10-25 07:20) Reply | Quote
gyms



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#17812


Posted: 2011-05-31 21:42  (Last Edited: 2011-05-31 21:48) Reply | Quote
Tommittaja

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#17813
Shouldn't you tell how those scales are formed?
I = full step
- = half step
major = II-III-
minor = I-II-II

and if you look closely, you'll notice that if you start the major scale on the 6th note, it's natural minor (aeolian)

chords are formed:
D major: you take the 1st, third and fifth note of the scale
D minor: same. but from the D minor scale.
minors and majors are always I-III-V from the scale.

something else:
sus2 chord: I-II-V
sus4 chord: I-IV-V
dim chord (diminished): I-III-IV (diminished fifth)
aug chord (augmented): I-IV-VI (augmented third and fifth)

E: maybe a little of this stuff too:
major 3rd, minor 3rd and so on ;D

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Posted: 2011-05-31 21:48  (Last Edited: 2012-10-25 07:20) Reply | Quote
gyms



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#17814


Posted: 2011-05-31 21:50 Reply | Quote
Tommittaja

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#17815
ah, okay then :D no explanations.
i just thought that explaining might help understanding.

it's like giving an answer to this: 7x^2+82x+2 = 0
and not explaining how it works. no one will remember it.

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Posted: 2011-05-31 21:56  (Last Edited: 2011-05-31 22:03) Reply | Quote
Xyz_39808

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#17816
How's this for a C Major tutorial?

[edit:]
"gbe-V(also called dominant)"
V add6 :E
[edit2:]
"it must be a note from the chord that is currently playing."
4-3 sus LOL


Attachments:
basic_1.ftm (4 Kb)
Posted: 2011-05-31 21:58  (Last Edited: 2012-10-25 07:20) Reply | Quote
gyms



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#17817


Posted: 2011-05-31 21:59  (Last Edited: 2012-10-25 07:21) Reply | Quote
gyms



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#17818


Posted: 2011-05-31 22:01  (Last Edited: 2012-10-25 07:21) Reply | Quote
gyms



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#17819


Posted: 2011-05-31 22:14 Reply | Quote
Xyz_39808

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#17820
[quote=Tommittaja]Shouldn't you tell how those scales are formed?
I = full step
- = half step
major = II-III-
minor = I-II-II
[/quote]
I think for this project, we should abstain from the "Why" and just stick to the "What" and "How". But we should definitely give out sources for study who really want to learn and understand the "why".
It should be enough to show by example how things work rather than showing the mechanics behind everything.

[quote]chords are formed:
D major: you take the 1st, third and fifth note of the scale
D minor: same. but from the D minor scale.
minors and majors are always I-III-V from the scale.
[/quote] I think this presentations is much more concise and intuitive than spelling out the D F# A for 'em.

[quote] something else:
sus2 chord: I-II-V
sus4 chord: I-IV-V
dim chord (diminished): I-III-IV (diminished fifth)
aug chord (augmented): I-IV-VI (augmented third and fifth)
[/quote]
Maybe we should hold off on the sus chords until we cover non-chord tones. Suspensions specifically. I'm not sure about when to include jazz chords in the course since I don't know anything about jazz nor how a normal student would learn it. Would it best to learn Baroque theory first?
[quote] E: maybe a little of this stuff too:
major 3rd, minor 3rd and so on ;D[/quote]
That should definitely be included in the minor lesson. "Look here, you have D F# A. But if we lower the F# to an F, you get a minor chord"
Maybe we should start off teaching with DM instead of CM so that when we get to this point the lowering of the 3rd will be easy to see than E to D#.

...or just go from Scale in C. Other keys. Then start working with DM.

Posted: 2011-05-31 22:16 Reply | Quote
Tommittaja

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#17821
why do you write the chords like this: ceg-V?
wouldn't it be easier to grasp if it was like
c major = CEG, in which G is the dominant (V = fifth)

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Posted: 2011-05-31 22:21  (Last Edited: 2012-10-25 07:21) Reply | Quote
gyms



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#17822


Posted: 2011-05-31 22:23  (Last Edited: 2012-10-25 07:21) Reply | Quote
gyms



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#17823


Posted: 2011-05-31 22:24  (Last Edited: 2011-05-31 22:36) Reply | Quote
Xyz_39808

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#17824
In my school, stuff dealing with Major modes were in capitals while stuff in minor was lower case. Always made it easy to tell what's going on. AM vs. am (we wrote it with a macron above the lowercase m. So Alt+772 (doesn't work on the forums)

I think we should throw in the terms "Tonic Supertonic, mediant, subdominant, dominant, submediant, leadiing tone" right at the start of defining scales. Just toss it at them and give the hint to only really pay attention to the Tonic, Dominant, and leading tone for now.

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